The following is a transcript of this episode. It has been edited for clarity.
Intro: If you’ve got a project you’re working on or a brand you’re cultivating, or if you’re just trying to navigate this crazy social media landscape, you’re gonna love this episode. I’m here with Kimara Mitchell, a brand strategist and a style influencer, who tells us everything she knows about self marketing, diving into social media and branding yourself like a boss. Plus, we talk fashion, including why it’s important to continue flaunting your style and how women over 40 are becoming the fashion mentors to a new generation. Welcome to More Beautiful, the podcast for women rewriting the midlife playbook. I’m Maryann LoRusso, and I invite you to join me and a guest each week as we strive for a life that’s more adventurous, more fulfilling and more beautiful than ever before.
Maryann: Welcome, everyone. I’m here today with the lovely Kimara Mitchell, an award winning creative director, graphic designer and brand strategist. Kim has tons of experience helping companies and influencers perfect their branding and digital marketing and content, and if that’s not enough, she’s also the founder of the fabulous fashion blog, J’adore Couture. Kim, welcome.
Kimara: Hi, thanks for having me.
Maryann: So fun to have you here. And on the show today we’re going to talk about social media, we’re going to talk about branding, and we’re going to also get a little bit into fashion for women over 40. But to start, Kim, it’d be great if you could tell our listeners a little bit about your career trajectory and the blog. Did you set out to become an influencer?
Kimara: Absolutely not.
Maryann: [Laughs]
Kimara: I was just growing up in Philadelphia, I had always loved fashion and style and design without even really knowing what design was. And I went to college, I actually majored in engineering in college. And around my junior year, I changed my major to advertising, started working in advertising agencies and design firms back in Philadelphia, decided I wanted to go to graduate school—which is what brought me to San Francisco—and my thesis for graduate school was to design a fashion magazine for women of color. And the head of my department at the time said, you know, you’re going to be doing all the writing for this magazine, you should start a blog. And I said, what is a blog? I don’t know what that is. So I just [Googled] “blogger” [and found out]. Then I just grabbed a username and just started writing. In the beginning, J’adore Couture was really more writing and essays about my thoughts on the fashion industry and fashion retail…Then it eventually morphed into a lot more about me and my personal style.
Maryann: So cool. Well, I’m glad it did. The misconception a lot of us do have is that influencers—and I think you’re an influencer, by the way—can only be 20-something women…taking selfies every five seconds, but this is not true. Are you finding that more women in their 40s, 50s and beyond are becoming influential online and elsewhere?
Kimara: Oh, absolutely. You think about the original influencers, they’re really actresses and people like that. And so when you think about [older] actresses—people like Diane Keaton and Meryl Streep and Jodie Foster and Angela Bassett—I mean, these are women that are very influential in terms of what they do with their careers and personal style…I do think in the beginning, there was this definite misconception that to be an influencer, to have a blog, you [had to be] in your 20s, and I think it has a lot to do with the technology aspect of it. But technology is something that kind of permeates every bit of our lives. And so it has been wonderful to see more influencers that are over 40, over 50, over 60 that are out there and showing their personal style, showing that just because you are now of a certain age, it’s not true that you have to wear certain things or that you can’t express yourself through fashion.
Maryann: Yeah, absolutely, and we’re going to talk more about that a little later. But just regarding what you said about the blog and stuff and the influencers in the early days, that word really tripped me up too because it felt to me like, oh, gosh, I thought you needed training to be a writer, a journalist. I went to journalism school, and I thought, why are these people just going online and doing a magazine? How is that possible? And I’m sure people in many fields felt that way—actors, for instance. So it really changed the game in so many ways in so many industries.
Kimara: Yeah, absolutely. I think that was definitely a criticism of blogging in the beginning. I remember the first few years that I started going to fashion shows when blogging was becoming bigger. And you would see these influencers in the front row of fashion shows that were normally relegated to press and the media and buyers, and you have this 20-something who just happened to start a blog right in the front row. I think there’s always going to be a place for fashion critics and people that do have, you know, traditional journalism skills and are true journalists. But I also think that there is a place for the person that is more looking at it from the everyday person’s point of view, and how does this relate to me as like an everyday person, because not every reader is going to know the history of a brand, or the history of where the inspiration a for a collection came from, or all of those things. They are going to want to know, well, how does this fit into my life, or how can I wear this in my life? And that’s where the everyday influencer kind of comes in?
Maryann: Yeah, so true. And I do feel like now it’s integrated a little bit more. Like, you do see mainstream magazines talking about influencers, interviewing influencers. They know they need influencers in their realm.
Kimara: Yes. I think that’s another thing that’s shifting, like you said, now that there are a lot more influencers that are in their 40s, 50s and 60s. It’s also nice to see the industry covering them, because I think for a while, it was also the case where the industry was maybe only covering a certain segment of influencers. But now you’re seeing a broader range of influencers getting press, being invited to events, being invited to fashion week, invited to collaborate with brands or to do their own collections. So again, I just think it’s good for the industry overall. And it’s just more inclusive.
Maryann: Right, absolutely. And going back to our generation, Gen X, and how a little bit of this was a shock to our system at first—we came of age before the internet, never mind social media. So many of them who are out there trying to brand and market themselves, maybe have a tendency to fall back a little bit on the old school ways of doing things, or maybe they’re afraid to put themselves out there on social media, still thinking it’s not something someone our age can do. What would you say to women who feel that?
Kimara: I always just say to just go for it. People have asked me if they feel like influencing is dead, or if they sort of missed the boat, if it’s too late to get into influencing. I think if you have a point of view and you have something unique that you bring to the table, it’s never too late. You know, I think people out there want to see and follow other people that they can relate to, and somebody that has maybe gone through things that they’ve gone through or are in a similar situation to them. For me in particular, when I started writing and photographing my style more, it was because I have a nine to five job. My nine to five job happens to be in a more creative space where I have a little bit more creative liberties in what I wear, but I still get dressed every day—or I was getting dressed every day, pre COVID—to go into an office. And so my thing was, I still want to have fun with how I get dressed. And there are many women out there that are going through that. And, you know, maybe their style is similar to mine, or maybe they have pieces in their closet that’s similar to mine. And so it’s the same way if you’re a suburban mom, or if you’re a mom that maybe has kids with special needs, or you run your own business. It kind of is something that people out there…as long as you feel like you have a unique point of view. And you can just put yourself out there, like I say, to go for it.
Maryann: Yeah. And we can really use social media to our advantage if we’re running a company or have a business, right? How would you suggest that a woman dives in, whether, you know, she’s a social media virgin, or she just doesn’t really know how to ramp up?
Kimara: Yeah, I think that the biggest thing is to just make sure before you even start that you have, like, a mission statement, or a statement of purpose about what your brand is about. And even beyond having that statement, having some key words of what your brand is and what your brand isn’t. And let those kind of be your guide, when you think about what you want to start posting. And it can even be as simple as a mood board. I’ve worked with brands before where they kind of use Instagram, for example, as almost like a Pinterest. I know it sounds counterproductive. But you know, when you’re just launching a brand and you want to give people a sense of what your brand is about, using Instagram as a mood board and just kind of posting pictures that are relevant to your brand or giving, if you have a product, sneak peeks of behind the process of the product, and just giving a few little snippets in there, can get people excited. And then you can, as you are sort of developing your own content, then you can start, you know, peppering your own content in there. But again, I think it just always starts with knowing who your brand is and posting things that are relevant to that, because I’ve seen a lot of brands try to copy somebody that’s very successful in the space. Or if you’re, say, a beauty brand, and do you like what, I don’t know what Apple does. And you’re trying to just leverage that same look and feel but your brand is maybe more natural, or whatever it is, that doesn’t really work.
Maryann: Right. I love the idea of a mood board. And I agree, I think if you try to copy someone else, it also makes you uneasy. Like, I feel like if you have a mission statement and you know what makes you unique or your brand unique, you can kind of stay focused, and you can start to sort of stay in your lane more effectively, right?
Kimara: Absolutely. Yes. And the good thing about Instagram in particular is that you can always go back and delete things. If [a former post feels] off brand, you can go back and look at your grid. And you can say, OK, maybe we’re shifting now to this other place, and these things don’t make sense anymore. You can always go back and curate your feed. Brands do this all the time when they do big launches. Like, when Gap first was teasing the Yeezy collection, they basically archived all of their posts, and they just had the posts up there that were relevant to the new collection. And then after a week or so, they unarchived them. So you can do things like that if you have a new product that’s launching or something that you want to tease as your brand starts to grow and as you start to refine what your visual language is, as I like to call it. If what you were posting in the beginning isn’t relevant anymore, you can go back and edit those things out or take those things out so that it does look more consistent.
Maryann: What a great tip. It’s like curating your closet. A lot of women are unsure about how many different social media platforms to be on, and how often to post things. And it can get so overwhelming.
Kimara: Yes, absolutely. I mean, in the very beginning, I kind of felt like I needed to be everywhere, I needed to be on every platform all the time. And as I have been in the industry for a while, both on the influencer side and on the creative side, I’ve learned that it’s better to be more focused. I primarily use Instagram and Pinterest and Facebook for blog things. I’m on Twitter, but my Twitter is more like me. I mean, I post fashion things on there, but I also post other things on there. I use Tumblr, but I treat Tumblr as a mood board, almost, like inspiration. But again, I think it’s just knowing your strengths, and playing to those strengths. And you don’t need to be on everything all the time.
Maryann: Right. And it’s tricky because our age group, too, like there’s still a lot of people over 40 on Facebook and not as much so on Instagram, so that’s a little tricky. You’re not in an over 40 niche, but I am. And that, you know, it’s just you don’t know what to do. It’s like experimentation, constantly, to see what’s working.
Kimara: Totally. It totally is. And I mean, I keep like an editorial calendar, so I kind of know what I want to post, when, and to what audience. Because like you said, my audience over on Facebook is a bit older, my audience on Instagram skews younger. Pinterest is kind of a hodgepodge of things. But yeah, it’s about, again, really looking into your analytics and reading the numbers that you have and understanding the audiences that you have on each platform that you’re on. And then developing a strategy of what you’re going to post, and also not posting the same thing on every single platform.
Maryann: Right? I absolutely agree.
Kimara: It needs to be tailored a little bit for each platform.
Maryann: And are you on TikTok? Because so many more women are getting on to TikTok. Older women. I’m amazed.
Kimara: I’m actually not on TikTok. I mean, I’m on TikTok as a watcher.
Maryann: I know, we’re all voyeurs.
Kimara: Yes, I am not on TikTok to make TikToks. I’m more on TikTok because it’s been crucial for my work, to kind of understand more about it and what’s trending and those kinds of things. But I am not making TikToks. But again, I mean, from everybody that I know that’s on it, they’ve all pretty much said that you kind of just need to dive into it. And you know, like, because a lot of TikTok is messy, for lack of a better word, a lot of Tiktok is people just experimenting.
Maryann: It’s a jungle out there.
Kimara: It is, but I’ve heard that it is a good place if you want to experiment with things. I think I had mentioned to you earlier that I am typically not somebody that does Instagram stories or Instagram lives where I’m talking to the camera. And one of my friends who’s also a content creator, she said that she kind of used TikTok as a place to test that and get more comfortable with it.
Maryann: OK, so test it out there and see how it goes.
Kimara: Yeah, test it out there and see how it goes.
Maryann: Yeah, it’s kind of a bummer that Instagram is trying to be TikTok now and so it is really pushing the video, the reels, and for people that don’t like that, it’s not easy.
Kimara: Right, It’s not, it’s not. And I mean, there are little tips and tricks that you can do, like, if you have an iPhone and you’re recording, you do videos, or you take photos in live mode, those are little video snippets. And you can string those together to make a real, or, you know, a lot of times if I’m taking photos of myself, I will actually take it as a video. And then I’ll just kind of cut it down to a photo, if I want a photo, or I’ll screen outline like a great frame, and I’ll screenshot it. But you can always turn that into a reel. Like you don’t, again, you don’t have to feel like you need to be this amazing video editor or videographer in order to create reels. I mean, obviously, people are doing fun transitions and things like that. But I think again, this is where there’s a ton of apps out there that can help you with things like that, if that’s something that you really want to do. But I hate that Instagram is trying to become Tik Tok. I did see a video the other day where…I think his name is Adam, he posted that, you know, he wants to try to find a sweet spot where the videos and the images can coexist.
Maryann: That would be great.
Kimara: Because I don’t want Instagram to turn into TikTok. We already have TikTok. And the beauty of Instagram is the wonderful imagery and still photography, and I want to still be able to see that.
Maryann: Yeah, and you know, the beauty of it, too, is you can really look on YouTube. There are so many tutorials to teach you how to do these things, these reels you can explore to your heart’s content.
Kimara: So many tutorials, like so many apps out there that make it really, really simple for you to edit video. Again, like, I think back in the day, it was all about having Adobe, like Creative Cloud. Even for blogs, you know, I would make my collages for my blog in Photoshop, because that’s what I was comfortable using. But a lot of people I know are like, oh, Photoshop is so intimidating, or trying to learn like Lightroom, or trying to learn premiere. It’s like, these programs are meant for, you know, industry professionals, they’re not necessarily meant for the everyday kind of casual creative person. And so it’s been great to see number one, Adobe has come out with Photoshop CC and sort of versions that don’t have all the bells and whistles, but they still give you the capabilities to do what you need to do. But then there are also all of these apps that have come out that make it super easy—very, very visual—where it’s like, oh, you want to add text? You just click this button. You want to shorten this video? You just do this. And it just makes it really easy for the everyday person to be able to create content and not have to learn a super complicated program or feel like they have to hire somebody and pay a lot of money.
Maryann: Right. You know, Photoshop is so overwhelming. And back when I started my first blog about 10 years ago, I just went straight to elements, which is a more amateur version. But now, I just use Canva, which is super easy. And little apps, like you said, like headliner to make audiograms and it’s just fun to find these apps, actually.
Kimara: Yeah, and I think you can discover new ones. And then you start to develop your toolkit of the apps that you like to use and the shortcuts that work best for you so that you can create content quickly and kind of move on to the next thing that you need to do.
Maryann: Yeah. So let’s talk a minute about criticism, because I know this influencer. She’s always putting herself out there, she’s on TikTok every day, and she’s a trooper, she’s really dedicated, but she told me, Maryann, this is really hard, like people are not kind out there, and they’re not kind to women over 40 especially. And she told me every day she gets comments like, hey, you know, hey grandma, shouldn’t you be doing blah, blah, blah or whatever? And so you have to have a tough skin sometimes to do this. What’s your strategy for dealing with trolls or just plain old mean people? I was gonna say another word, but, you know…
Kimara: [Laughs] Yeah, you know, growing up, I always sort of saw myself as not somebody who wanted to be the center of attention, like somebody that wanted to be kind of like in the background, just doing her thing, kind of like chugging along. And so it’s sometimes it’s funny for me to think that I take pictures of myself and post them on the internet for everybody to see.
Maryann: It’s your alter ego doing that.
Kimara: It is, it is, it’s very funny that I do that. You know, I think you definitely have to have a thick skin. And just know that when people are criticizing you, it’s much more about them than it is about you. It really is. I mean, to me, for somebody to take the time to write something negative when they could just not say anything at all, it’s just much more about them than it is about you and what you’re doing. I only had to block one person.
Maryann: [Laughs] That’s great. Just one?
Kimara: In my time, I’ve only had to block one person, and it was a person, actually, on Facebook. I find that I get the most criticism on Facebook, which is interesting, because Facebook is where there are, as we’ve mentioned earlier, a lot of followers over 40. And so it’s interesting that most of the criticism I feel like I get is on Facebook. But yes, every time I would do a post, there was this particular woman that would just say, that’s ugly. Or, why did you pick those shoes, they don’t go with the outfit. Or, you know, sometimes she would just write, “trash”.
Maryann: You know, I remember Brené Brown once said, you know, that people don’t have the right to criticize unless they’re in the arena doing the work that you’re doing. And I always try to remember that. And I also tried to think, like you’re saying, maybe someone’s really sad, really hates their life. I mean, that’s what I try to imagine. Like maybe, you know, you’re right, it’s about them. It’s not about you.
Kimara: Yeah, so like, you know, for a while it really bummed me out. And, you know, I could tell by the picture of her, she looked like she was around my age. And it just made me think I’m like, well, maybe, you know, maybe she’s just used to somebody that dresses in a more traditional, sort of, way, and that follows kind of those “rules” that we’ve talked about of what you don’t wear over 40. Like, oh, I’m in a miniskirt, like, you don’t wear that after 40. Or, you know, you don’t match your heels to your bag. Like, you know, maybe that’s just what she thinks is fashionable. And then, after a while I just, you know, the comments were just getting to be a little too much, and I just blocked her. It didn’t stop me from getting negative comments from other people. But I do think, again, to me, it’s more about them, that they are taking the energy to even write something when you could just ignore it and move on with your day and your life. You know, there is such a thing as hate following. And, you know, I thankfully don’t know anybody who has dealt with this, but I have definitely read about it, it’s definitely a thing. And I just think, again, it’s that person, and it’s not you. And I know it can be tough when you are putting yourself out there and especially if you’re putting yourself out there in a very personal way in terms of your personal style, or maybe beauty, or whatever it is. It can be hard, and just know that the majority of the comments that you’re probably getting are positive comments, and focus on those.
Maryann: Yeah. I mean, this woman-on-woman viciousness really gets me. It’s horrible when it happens. And I also feel like nowadays, you know, because our country is so divided, I feel like anytime you do anything half of the people in this country like it, half hate it. Like, it’s just you have to get used to criticism.
Kimara: Yes, yes. And I think for me, especially since, you know, since 2020—and probably before 2020, but even more so in 2020—I have definitely posted on Instagram things that are not fashion related. You know, I posted about George Floyd, I posted about Breanna Taylor, I posted about school shootings, I posted about the wildfires in California. You know, I posted about abortion. And there’s this rumor that people can get shadow banned—you know, depending on the type of content that you’re posting—and that Instagram will maybe not show your posts to as many people. And I definitely feel like recently, I’ve not gotten as many likes, and my posts haven’t gotten the reach that they used to get before I posted about Roe v Wade.
Maryann: Interesting. Shadow bans on political stuff. Hm.
Kimara: Yeah. But, you know, I’ve definitely heard about this. And again, like, I’ve talked to other influencers in the space, and they’ve mentioned the same thing. And so, you know, it’s disheartening. If you don’t like what I have to say, there are tons of other people out there that you can find that maybe align with your political views or align with your views about the country or about fashion or about beauty or really about anything. Like, you just don’t need to, you don’t need to follow me if it’s not something that resonates with you.
Maryann: Right. Gosh, what you just said—I mean, we could do an entire episode just on that, like what the topic of whether or not you should use your platform for what you believe in, politics. Because, you know, on the surface, it seems like, you know, for example, you have a nice little fashion blog, or whatever you’re doing out there. But you do have your own beliefs. And maybe, you know, do you use that platform? Is it a moral imperative to use that platform? Should you stay away? Should you play it safe? I mean, that is a whole other thing we talk about.
Kimara: No, it is, it’s like a whole other thing. And, you know, I think about this line that somebody had said about LeBron James, actually, when he was speaking out about some things that were happening in the country, and somebody told him to just shut up and dribble.
Maryann: Oh, I know.
Kimara: Aand I just was like, OK, but you know, he’s not here for your entertainment. Yes, he has a job, and his job is to be a basketball player. But we all live on this planet. We all exist as people in this world. We all have views on things, and we should have opinions on what’s happening in this world that we all live in. And it shouldn’t matter if you are a basketball player, or an actor, or a fashion blogger, or a teacher or whatever you are. You should be able to express your views on that and not be discounted because of what you do.
Maryann: Right. And that ties into your authenticity, right? Because that’s so important.
Kimara: It does, it ties 100% into your authenticity. And I think it’s up to the individual, it’s always up to the individual, how much they want to talk about it or not want to talk about it on their platform. You know, for me personally, I do feel like if you do have a following, if you do have a reach, that it’s…To me, I would want to use my platform for good, and to, you know, bring more awareness to something. And it doesn’t have to be the whatever, the thing of the moment, necessarily, it can be something that is just important to you. Say you have a sister who is going through cancer treatments, or whatever it is, you can talk about that. It doesn’t have to be about politics or gun violence, or it doesn’t have to be about Roe vs. Wade or whatever it is. But I do think if you have that following, I personally think you should use your following for good. I mean, I don’t hate other bloggers or influencers for not doing that. I just think if you have that sort of reach, and you’re able to connect with that many people…I mean, that’s the definition of the word influence.
Maryann: I agree 100%, yeah. So, let’s talk about fashion a little bit. I know we touched on it, but I want to talk about women over 40 and fashion. Social media is changing the way, you know, women over 40 are being seen. I mean, I think so many things are changing that. I think the fact that more women are directing and producing movies and TV shows and writing, you know, programs and social media, is enabling us to get out there and become influencers. And you and I talked about this earlier, but one cool thing that seems to be happening is that, instead of being thought of as the old bras who don’t know anything anymore, women are being seen as the fashion mentors to younger women. Do you think this is the beginning of some real change in how women of a certain age are perceived in fashion or otherwise?
Kimara: I hope so, I really hope so. You know, I think I have definitely noticed, when it comes to fashion magazines and advertising campaigns and partnerships, that bigger brands are doing—and when I say bigger brands, I mean like the Chanels, the Guccis, the St. Lawrence of the world—they’re doing ad campaigns with women that are of a certain age. Or, you know, somebody like Gucci has somebody like Miley Cyrus next to somebody like Diane Keaton, next to Serena Williams. That’s just nice to see. Like, that type of diversity, versus everybody looking like Giselle or Kate Moss. And I think that’s sort of the era that we, as Gen Xers, were kind of used to. You know, you kind of went from the supermodel age, or like the 80s, where it was like Cindy Crawford and that type of model, and then everybody started to look like Kate Moss, and then everybody started to look like Giselle, but it was all like, same, same, same, right? Yes, it was a shift in the industry and it was a shift in like, the body type and all those things, but then everybody looked like that. Everybody was like Kate Moss, or everybody was like Cindy Crawford. And now, yes, you might see like Kendall Jenner in like five things, or you might see Haley Bieber in five things, but you’re also going to see a much broader range of women across age and size and ethnicity. And I think that is really lovely and refreshing to see. You know, I think about a few years ago, when Phoebe Philo was still at Celine…She put Joan Didion in an ad, and I felt like people lost their minds. It was like, oh my gosh, Joan Didion. It’s like, yes, she’s a beautiful woman, she’s a muse to a lot of people. You know, why not have her in a fashion ad? You know, I brought up Diane Keaton a lot. She’s another person that I think people…
Maryann: We all love her.
Kimara: People love her, and she has her own personal style. And it’s very much like that Annie Hall, kind of Ralph Lauren vibe, and she doesn’t really deviate from it. But people love her. You know, but then you have women like Tilda Swinton and Cate Blanchett and Angela Bassett and Viola Davis, that are women that really love to experiment with their fashion. You know, I think Diane Keaton is on one end of the spectrum because she kind of is tried and true to who she is and doesn’t really deviate from that. And even in her ad for Gucci, she was in Gucci, but she still looked very much like Diane Keaton. Whereas I think if you think about those other women, they love to experiment with fashion and style. And you know, sometimes they’re a little bit more avant garde, sometimes they’re a little bit more classic, sometimes they are a little bit more feminine. And again, I think brands have taken notice of that and are using them, which is great. I think the other thing that has changed, like you said, like this inspiration and younger people being inspired is, is Instagram, in the fact that people behind the scenes are now using Instagram to promote themselves. People like stylists. Like, I follow quite a few stylists for celebrities on Instagram. And so they will be posting photos of getting their celebrity dressed, whoever it is. And it’s like, again, I think people are seeing that out there and they’re like, oh, look at Viola Davis wearing, you know, this beautiful gown or, you know…Somebody that I absolutely love to follow is Tracee Ellis Ross.
Maryann: Oh, you’re the second person who’s mentioned her to me.
Kimara: Yeah, who has obviously, you know, she comes from royalty when it comes to fashion. But she also is somebody who worked in fashion when she was younger. I believe she interned atlike Harper’s Bazaar, or she worked at Harper’s Bazaar when she was younger. She obviously kind of loves fashion, and also has fun with fashion. And so there’s been so many times when I’ve been scrolling through Instagram, and I’ll see somebody post one of her reels, or a photo of her in their Instagram Stories of like, check this out. And it’s amazing, it’s great to see that, you know, that people are looking at her and looking at her style and looking at how she’s having fun with fashion and like getting dressed up. And she’s, like, out at the pool wearing a skimpy bikini. Or she’s at a gala, and she’s showing herself in her gala gown, but with sneakers and eating a hamburger. It’s like, she’s being real, but she’s still having fun with it. And she’s showing you like, yes, I am—I think she’s, I think she might be 50 now, or maybe 48, but she’s like, I’m having fun with this, I get to dress up and do these things so I’m gonna make it fun.
Maryann: I agree with you. There’s so many celebrities now just really inspiring us and of all ages. But I also think it’s real life women. I mean, I’ve always been infatuated with older women as fashionistas. I remember, in the early 80s, in middle school, one of my friends’ mother had this gigantic closet and we would go in there and take all of her Candies mules and her Studio 54. She actually went, you know, dancing, and she had those like leggings and the big sweaters, and we would just parade around in this stuff. And I’d think, I can’t wait to be older and get to wear this stuff. And also, when I was an editor at the WWD group, there was an older woman, I’ll never forget her. And she wrote a column since the 60s, she was a fashion editor, and I was just enthralled by her. Like, all the history, you know, all that. I mean, I always couldn’t stop thinking about what she knew, who she knew, all through the decades. And that’s a really cool experience, especially now that vintage clothing is so popular.
Kimara: So popular. And it’s actually popular with younger people, which is nice to see, that younger people are getting into vintage and discovering the beauty of vintage. But yeah, like you said, it’s not just the celebs. It is like the regular people. I mean, I follow quite a few influencers that are over 40, and they all are just so different. Like, some of them are more of like the Scandinavian kind of style of dressing. Carla Rockmore is somebody that just loves fashion, loves color. There’s a woman that I follow, I think it’s Grece Ghanem.
Maryann: Oh, you’re gonna have to spell that for us, I have no idea.
Kimara: Yes, it’s Greece Ghanem. But she is, I believe she’s in her 60s, and, you know, like beautiful silver bob, and just loves fashion and is wearing heels, she’s wearing bikinis, she’s doing stuff for Chanel and going to Fashion Week, and again, is just a beautiful, beautiful person and loves color and loves all the things that, you know, traditionally it would be like, oh, no, you shouldn’t be wearing that anymore. It’s like, who cares?
Maryann: Who cares is right, yeah. You mentioned fashion magazines. I have to say, I miss those thick September issues, right, and all the old fashion seasons where you knew like in August the stores were going to just be loaded with all the new fall merchandise and you’d be, you know, flipping through those big magazines. I missed that a little bit. Fashion is so different now. I feel like it’s just year round product drops, instant availability. How do you feel about that?
Kimara: I definitely have a love-hate relationship with that, because one of the things that’s really important to me, in terms of what I communicate to my audience, is that you don’t have to buy a lot of things to be fashionable or to feel like you’re fashionable. And so I also missed those days, like I remember being younger and waiting for the September magazines, it was like, yes, I was reading Vogue and Harper’s Bazaar, but I was also reading Mademoiselle—I miss Mademoiselle…
Maryann: Oh, I know, me too.
Kimara: And you know, like Marie Claire and magazines like that, that featured maybe a little bit more affordable fashion, affordable style. And sort of earmarking things, and like making a list of the things that I need for the new season. But yes, now it’s sort of like the brands are trying to react to what’s happening with fast fashion, and they’re dropping new products like every month. And I think it just creates this, like, consumerism, and it creates this feeling that again, people need to like buy, buy, buy, when they really don’t. When they really just need to, like, look in their closet and maybe see if there are gaps or holes, versus, oh, I need to go shopping and I need to buy all of these things. And, you know, fashion is, unfortunately, very wasteful. It’s a very wasteful industry. And so, to me, it’s like less about, well, I need to buy new stuff every month, or I need to tell my readers to buy new things all the time. It’s more about, you know, is there something cool coming out that maybe you might need to have in your closet? Are there more affordable versions of it out there? Or is it something that you can easily get from, like, shopping your closet? I mean, a great example of this is a few years ago, I remember seeing oversized denim jackets kind of everywhere. And I was like, ah, I love a denim jacket. It’s the kind of piece to me that can dress down a look.
Maryann: It’s so versatile.
Kimara: It’s super versatile. And I mean, I have like a classic denim jacket, you know, a more fitted style that, you know, hints at your waist. But everybody was showing these, and I think it started with Balenciaga showing some on the runway where they actually had a denim jacket…Like, it was so big that it could be unbuttoned and worn off the shoulder. And I just was like, oh, I gotta find an oversized denim jacket. I started looking, of course, and it was, you know, $300, $400 because the trend hadn’t gotten to, like, a Zara.
Maryann: It hadn’t trickled down yet.
Kimara: It hadn’t trickled down yet. And then I thought about going to The Gap. I was like, oh, I could just buy a men’s jacket from The Gap, but then the proportions might not be right. And around this time was when my parents were downsizing their house, and they said, you know, you need to come and go through your stuff that’s in the basement.
Maryann: Oh, I know what you’re getting at.
Kimara: I had things that were in the basement from when I was in high school and in my 20s that I had just stored down there, and I had this amazing Calvin Klein denim jacket.
Maryann: Calvin Klein did them really well back then.
Kimara: Really, really well. And it was perfect. Because of course it was in…you know, my mom had those trunks with like the cedar blocks in them that kept your clothes protected and whatnot. And I pulled that out and I just was like, this is it, this is perfect. And I found so many other things, actually, in those boxes. You know, I had vintage T-shirts, vintage concert T-shirts.
Maryann: Oh my god. Your mom is so awesome for keeping that stuff.
Kimara: I know. I had a vintage Esprit sweatshirt. I had, you know, an old Bongo, which I don’t think even exists anymore. I had a Bongo denim moto jacket.
Maryann: At first I thought you said Bong. [Laughs] I thought you said you had a bong. OK, Bongo.
Kimara: Yeah, so, you know, I found so many great flea pieces. And I was like, I’m bringing all of these back to San Francisco. And I had a Depeche Mode concert T-shirt, and somebody asked me about it. They were like, oh, is that vintage? Like, oh, did you get that at a vintage store? And I was like, no, I bought this in 1990, you know, at a concert. So, you know…
Maryann: You should do a reel on all the stuff you found. That would be so cool.
Kimara: [Laughs] I should actually, that would be very cool. But yeah, you know…
Maryann: And kudos to you for being the same size as you were in high school, number one.
Kimara: Well, I will say that back in those days—and I’m sure you probably remember this—you bought everything oversized.
Maryann: We were planning ahead. [Laughs]
Kimara: We were. Like, all of those concert T shirts, like I look at the tags. And they all say extra large. And, you know, the Calvin Klein jacket I think was a medium, but it was already cut really, really big. But again, that’s the kind of thing where it’s like, OK, you see this trend on the runway, or everybody’s talking about this trend. And my first instinct was to literally go on to Shopbop or go on to Net-A-Porter, and start looking and wanting to try to find it to buy it. Versus, I could have gone to a vintage store. Or you could maybe look in your closet, if it’s something where maybe it’s like, a trend is being reworked. You can take a skirt, maybe, that you really like, and shorten it. You can take a jacket and alter it. You know, it doesn’t have to be like, oh, I need to go and spend $300 or $400 on something.
Maryann: Right, such a great time. And also the quality of the stuff back then was so much better.
Kimara: So much better. So yeah, so for me, it’s more about the quality versus quantity. And I think, yeah, the fashion cycle right now is so fast, and it’s hard to keep up. It’s hard to keep up with, like, what’s in, what’s out, whatever. And so that’s why I’m just always like, I try not to worry about trends and get too into trends. If there’s a trend that I would like to play into, I always say, you know, shop your closet first and see if you have it in your closet or if you can take the pieces that you have in your closet and maybe remix them in a new way so that you can feel like you’re a part of the trend. And the thing about trends too is trends come in and out. So it’s like, you don’t want to invest $400 in something that you might only wear like a season, or you might decide is not right for you.
Maryann: It’s so true. I think this fast fashion thing is something we can’t pay too much attention to. And especially, I feel like as I’ve gotten older, I’m really careful about what I buy. Like you said, I’m shopping my closet more. And not only because of the environmental implications of all this, you know, buying fashion and discarding—and I hate that—but because it’s gonna sound crazy, but I think about my legacy and what I want to be in my closet when I die, what I want my kids to inherit and think about. I want only those pieces that are really important to me. I don’t want to have a billion, you know, whatever sitting in my closet.
Kimara: No, absolutely. I think I was a bit spoiled when my parents had their bigger house, because I was not somebody who would purge things a lot. You know, I would just say, if it was something that I wasn’t wearing, or if it was something that didn’t fit, I would just like put it in the back of my closet or I would put it in one of those storage trunks and it would just stay there. I think one of the good things about being in San Francisco is you are definitely struggling for closet space. And so you really only want to keep the pieces that you love, the pieces that you’re wearing a lot. I probably purge things at least once a quarter and just go through my closet and just get rid of things. I’m big on taking things to a tailor. I only want to have things in here that are things that I love, things that I’m really going to wear and things that make me happy.
Maryann: What are the three items in your closet you can’t live without?
Kimara: Number one has to be a blazer. I have loved Blazers for as long as I can remember ever since I was a young teenager going to thrift stores in New York with my aunt. I always just thought throwing an oversized blazer over something just looked so cool, like a blazer and Levis were just…
Maryann: And so easy.
Kimara: So easy. It is, like, literally so easy. I always tell people that if you don’t know what to wear, just do a pair of clean denim, like minimal distressing, whatever color you want. Like a nice straight leg or slimmer fit. A blazer. You can do a black T-shirt, a white T-shirt, a white button down, and then whatever shoe you want to do. You’re dressed. It’s so simple. So definitely a blazer. I would probably say a pair of heels. I know in COVID I haven’t been wearing heels as much, but I love a fun heel. Because I think if you do have that blank canvas of like a black blazer, a T-shirt and a pair of denim, you can change how that look is or how it comes together based on your shoe choice. Like I could pick…I have a pair of, like, glittery Miu Miu sandals that are like cobalt blue.
Maryann: I love that color.
Kimara: Yeah, one of my favorite colors. Or I could do a black and white cheetah print, YSL pump, or I could do just like a clean white sandal. I think I just love how some sort of a heel, the color or print, can just change things up. So I would definitely say that.
Maryann: I’m glad you said that. I love my heels. What’s your number three?
Kimara: I still love my heels. I actually wore a pair last night because I went out and I was like, I’m definitely wearing heels. For you guys. Where are you healed? There weren’t a lot of people wearing heels, but I was like I’m gonna do it.
Maryann: And you must be supremely statuesque when you put your heels on, because you’re tall as it is.
Kimara: I mean, I’m not that tall. I’m like 5’5.
Maryann: You look taller in your photos. It’s your presence.
Kimara: I have heard that often. When they see me in person, people are like, oh, I thought you were gonna be taller…
Maryann: Some people expect me to be tall too, and I’m only 5’1. It must be my big mouth. [Laughs]
Kimara: The third thing…is probably a dress. I love anything that’s like a one and done, where you just throw it on and you get out the door. And dresses don’t have to be complicated. I do love a simple T-shirt dress, like a long T-shirt or a long sweater dress, I think, is very chic. I also love those sort of, like, ribbed, knit, tank top dresses that have like a high neck, and then they have the arms that kind of like come in. I think those are very sexy. And again, it’s the kind of thing where you could put sneakers on with that and run errands, or if you’re going out to dinner, you can throw on a heel and throw your blazer over your shoulder and look very chic.
Maryann: Do you think there should be any fashion rules for women over 40?
Kimara: No.
Maryann: Good. I agree.
Kimara: No, I just don’t believe in that. I feel like you wear what you want, you wear what you feel comfortable in and you feel confident in, and that’s what’s going to come across. If you are someone who doesn’t feel comfortable showing their legs and you wear a miniskirt, you’re going to feel self-conscious the whole time. But if you’re somebody that…Maybe you love your shoulders, maybe you love your collarbones, so you wear long pants and you wear these great tops, maybe you wear a tube top, to show off your neckline and your collarbone. I think someone would probably say, oh, women over 40 shouldn’t wear a tube top. Who cares?
Maryann: Who cares, yeah.
Kimara: If that’s the part of your body you love the most, you show it off. Or if it’s your back, or whatever, if it’s your arms. Some women are self conscious about their arms, but they love their legs. It’s about wearing those pieces that you feel good in, that you feel confident in, no matter what your age is.
Maryann: Yeah. Since turning 40, I have worn a tube top, a miniskirt, stilettos, a crop top… [Laughs] I would be on a lot of lists right now, if I were well-known.
Kimara: Oh, yeah. I would definitely be on a lot of lists right now. Last night when I went out, I wore a skimmed crop…It’s like a cropped T-shirt, but it basically comes right under where your bra would hit.
Maryann: Like your rib cage, sort of?
Kimara: Yeah, I guess it is a rib cage. But I wore that. I mean, I wear bikinis, I wear miniskirts—I wear miniskirts a lot, because I do like my legs, and I like looks that are more covered on top and then shorter on the bottom. So a long-sleeved mini dress is probably my favorite thing. So yeah, I would be on a lot of lists.
Maryann: Good for you. I mean, the way I look at it is, I’m not out there running, hitting the pavement, three miles a day, to cover my legs up. That’s not going to work for me, you know?
Kimara: Exactly. I work out five to six times a week, I run, I do pilates, all those things. I do that because I want to stay healthy, yes, but I’ve been an athlete for years. I love my legs.
Maryann: Yep, good for you. OK. Well, one more question, Kim. If you had to offer any advice to our listeners out there, to women who are embracing and enjoying fashion in midlife, what would it be?
Kimara: Honestly, to just have fun, and to just not take it so seriously. I think the beauty of fashion is that you can have fun with it. Like, yes, it’s functional, yes, you need functional clothing, absolutey. But you can also have fun with that. If you’re somebody that loves wearing sweatshirts and leggings, you can wear the most fun leggings and the most fun sweatshirts out there. You can wear sweatshirts that are off the shoulder. Whatever it is. You can wear really fun sneakers—there are so many amazing sneakers out there. No matter what it is, just have fun with it.
Maryann: I love that. Life is short, have fun with it, just like you said.
Kimara: Exactly. Life is short, wear the shoes.
Maryann: Thank you so much for joining us. This was such a fun conversation.
Kimara: Yes, it was so much fun. Thank you again for having me.
